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Discussion in 'Help and Advice' started by MrLarner, Jan 14, 2010.

  1. MrLarner

    MrLarner Registered

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    Its friday tomorrow and pay day [011.gif]
    so on saturday im off to the LFS to buy...

    loads of RO water (to fill the osaka 155),

    10lb of aragonite sand, which will be mixed with my current live sand.

    2 power heads, getting 2 x Hydor Korolia Circulation reef water pump 900LPH, was told that is perfect for 155 litre tank, correct?

    some filter floss and carbon for the fluval 205 which will be in use. (already have live rock rubble from the smaller tank and phosphate remover) to go in as well.

    some copepods so my maderin can feast for a while [005.gif]

    and finally some natureform replica rock, to use as a base for my live rock to sit on.

    few questions....
    1 - what should i have in my fluval 205? i thought it should be... rock rubble (bottom), phosphate remover, carbon and filter floss in the compartments.... yeah?
    2- do i pour the whole jar of copepods straight into the tank (all over the rocks)
    3- should i have the natureform replica rocks all at the bottom or can mix it about with the live rock?
    [thumbup.gif]
     
  2. Ged

    Ged Registered

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    Pour them in at night when lights are off if you have any fish in. If not, just pour them in.
     
  3. rabbut

    rabbut Registered

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    1 - what should i have in my fluval 205? i thought it should be... rock rubble (bottom), phosphate remover, carbon and filter floss in the compartments.... yeah?

    Sounds good to me. Floss in a Fluval will be blocked within a week IME, but this is how often I'd recommend cleaning it out anyway on a marine system, so what the heck, may as well [thumbup.gif]

    2- do i pour the whole jar of copepods straight into the tank (all over the rocks)

    That will work, as Ged has said [027.gif] I tend to dump them into the rockwork itself with a Turkey baster [001_smile.gif]

    3- should i have the natureform replica rocks all at the bottom or can mix it about with the live rock?

    Mixing it up will be fine, just so long as all the rock is getting plenty of flow [thumbup1.gif]
     
  4. MrLarner

    MrLarner Registered

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    cheers guys, 1 more thing, i know i spoke about it in a previous thread but im worried,
    on saturday after i have bought 4 lots of 25litre tubs of RO water and got them home, i want to salt them before i put them into the tank, but i dont have something to pour 25 litres into so i can put a airline and powerhead in to mix it up.
    so if i just pour 865grams of salt into each container and leave it over night, will that disolve, or does there really need to be somethinf stirring it all up?
    if so, how can i get around this.
    im new to marine so dont have loads of equiment like you guys.
    i'll be there soon but just not yet [wink.gif]
    i just want to be able to salt all 4 containers before pouring it into the tank, because i was planning to put sand in first.
     
  5. Ged

    Ged Registered

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    If you can get to Wilkinsons, they do wine brewing buckets that are 25ltrs for about £9

    http://www.wilkinsonplus.com/Home-Brewi ... vt/0022555

    Pour the RO into it, then add the salt and then stick a powerhead in. If you can mix it that way for a couple of hours or so, then you should be good to go. Then do the next lot etc - It's not ideal but will help solve your problem. This way you can then use the barrel for your weekly changes.

    Or ask your LFS to lend you something to mix it up in, most LFS will do so even if it means leaving a deposit.
     
  6. moonloop

    moonloop Registered

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    In my opinion those 2 Koralias wont be enough (1800lph combined) - you should be aiming for at least 20x turnover per hour (3000-3500lph).

    Personally i would use 2x koralia 1s (not nanos) or possibly a 1 and a 2 - depending on what corals you want to keep.

    P.s. can you not mix the salt and water in the tank itself using the powerheads that you buy then add the sand a day or two later when it has all mixed properly.


    Kai
     
  7. rabbut

    rabbut Registered

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    The work-around I use at work when we sell out of salted RO, (provided the customer has an air pump and air line to hand) is as follows;

    Add salt to containers
    Half fill with fresh RO
    Give a really good prolonged shake
    Fully fill with RO
    Instruct the customer to airate the container with an airline for at least 24h before use.

    The salted RO water does require mixing before you use it with live stock. Failing to mix it properly before adding that much will likely lead to a lack of Oxygen in the tank, and salt burns on your stock [sad.gif] If you don't have an air pump and air lines, to mix your own RO in the tubs themselves, you'll need to get one when you go to the LFS for all the other bits. You'll also need airline and long enough gang-valve to split however many outlets the air pump has into 4 separate lines - one for each container [thumbup1.gif]

    If this still isn't clear, re-read Tina's (tigerinssey's) response in the other thread. If after that it still isn't clear, feel free to ask for clarification before you go get all the stuff [001_smile.gif]

    Ged's solution will also work well, but you need to mix for at least 24 hours when your adding as much new water as you are old stuff. RO is devoid of almost anything dissolved in it - including Oxygen. This needs to be added back, along with your salt. [thumbup1.gif] As Kai mentions, most LFS's can help with containers also if asked [001_smile.gif]

    Kai raises a good point about your pumps no that's been pointed out. Good catch, I missed that one [blushing.gif]
     
  8. Ged

    Ged Registered

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    As you have stated. Future water changes should be mixed for 24 hours or so definitely. I was just thinking of a quick fix for now.
     
  9. MrLarner

    MrLarner Registered

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    How do you work it out then? because the way i was told, 2 x900lph was perfect.
    i cant remember exactly how i was told now, but something like...
    155 (which is my litres of tank) x 20 then diveded by 2 and that equals 1550lph
    or have i done something wrong?
     
  10. moonloop

    moonloop Registered

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    Not sure why you were told to divide by 2.
    To achieve the desired 20x turnover, take your total tank volume and multiply by 20. If you then divide by 2 you will only get 10x turnover.

    HTH

    Kai
     
  11. MrLarner

    MrLarner Registered

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    Thats a point, im not sure why i got told divide by 2, maybe because i mentioned i was getting 2 power heads [confused1.gif]
    so if thats the case, 2 900lp aint enough is it,
    i've already ordered 1 900lph power head so what should the other 1 be?
     
  12. Ged

    Ged Registered

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    Slightly OT

    Does that mean I have my MP40W on too fast for my tank then?

    80g * 20 = 1600gph

    Vortech = 1,000-3,200 gallons per hour and I have it nearly on full all the time apart from sleep mode.
     
  13. fieldy132

    fieldy132 Registered

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    i said divide by two as you were getting two power heads...i didnt check your maths!!!

    155x20=3100

    3100\2=1550

    2 power heads at 1550lph!!!
     
  14. TigerIssey

    TigerIssey Registered

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    Nope, 20x is the minimum, I know people running SPS set ups that have over 70x circulation [thumbup.gif]

    IMO vortechs are different anyway, they are just the dogs doodahs and work in specific modes [thumbup1.gif] I will get some eventually.
     
  15. moonloop

    moonloop Registered

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    The vortechs provide a pulsing motion and are generally not running at 100% power all the time (unless you have it on continuous flow)

    If you have a tank full of SPS then that will be fine anyway as SPS corals prefer a much higher flow over them.

    I find that:

    20x turnover for soft corals
    30x turnover for LPS corals
    40x + turnover for SPS corals generally works very well, but there is always the occasional coral that strays from this.

    Kai
     
  16. Ged

    Ged Registered

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    Thanks for the headsup.
     
  17. moonloop

    moonloop Registered

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    Ahh.... now i get it!! - just a slight mis-understanding.
     
  18. MrLarner

    MrLarner Registered

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    because i have a 900lph on the way, can i buy a 1500lph or even a 1600lph to make up for the loss? or will both pumps need to be equal?
    could i even use a 5000lph and just aim it at a rock?
    if so... fieldy is that offer still on? [001_tongue.gif]
     
  19. rabbut

    rabbut Registered

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    The water movement is well covered above. There only remains one bit left unanswered. You want a 2200lph pump for your second flow source [thumbup1.gif]

    Going back to Ged's comments on the water mixing...

    I would suggest that mixing water for 24h before using it is more important here than with water changes. Your doubling the amount of water in the system, and moving your stock strait across. You can get away with as little as 30mins mixing for smaller water changes, but on a larger one like that, you need to mix a lot longer to get Oxygen into the water before you use it or your heading for trouble [sad.gif] Likewise with heating. this new water needs to be up-to-temperature before you try to use it with existing live-stock. On what is effectively a large water change, you can't really cut as many corners as you could doing a little change [crying.gif]

    However.....

    I have done water changes of this size with half an hours mixing and no pre-heating before on the Nano I used to have. The only side-effects I observed was a longer strop time for the corals. However, doing this is highly risky and not recommended, even though you can get away with it in some cases [thumbdown.gif] Certainly, if you are fairly in-experienced and don't know how to respond to chemical stress/shock in your fish, this isn't a smart way to water change.

    To catch-up with posts after I typed all that out... No, the pumps you use don't need to be equal [thumbup1.gif]
     
  20. moonloop

    moonloop Registered

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    I would go for something like a Koralia 2 or tunze 6025
     
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